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Thread: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

  1. #11
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Randy,

    I owe Pete a call soon, so I'll ask him.

    I also agree with your assesment of the pull harder, stall / spin regime. However, with the small education I have in aerodynamics and such, I would suspect you allow a vortice to set up and become more concentrated if you remove the smooth contour of a fairing. It might not be the reason the aircraft stalled and spun in, but it certainly didn't help.

    Good posts all around. Interesting.
    Scotty G

  2. #12
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Haskin
    During the course of research for my book on Cavalier, I've run across numerous "facts" that have been printed and re-printed by several authors, only to find out that they're all incorrect.
    Yeah, I faced the same problem when researching the Beguine - a few sources said that the wings were of equal length, some not. I was just surprised that when the guy who was instrumental in building the aircraft (in a taped interview) said there was 6" cut off the left wing that some still insisted that wasn't correct. Sometimes the facts are inconsequential - simply because people choose to believe what they wish to, despite the facts.

    Best of luck on your book and quest for info
    Mark K....

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Quote Originally Posted by Cobra
    Yeah, I faced the same problem when researching the Beguine - a few sources said that the wings were of equal length, some not. I was just surprised that when the guy who was instrumental in building the aircraft (in a taped interview) said there was 6" cut off the left wing that some still insisted that wasn't correct. Sometimes the facts are inconsequential - simply because people choose to believe what they wish to, despite the facts.

    Best of luck on your book and quest for info

    Markster...the skinny on the Beguine, from Ed Horkey, the chief engineer on the project, was that the 6" difference was a complete RUMOR. In all the research I've done on the plane (and I did a ton of it back in the early '80's), the rumors varied from 6-18 inches of how much was cut off. Seems the legend grows as the story gets passed on. But the reality of it was that one wing pod was heavier than the other, which gave the flight characteristic of wanting to roll easier to the left than the right, but there was NOT a shorter wing on one side...despite the accepted belief that there was. If you take any symmetrical shot (head on, top/bottom view) and even go so far as to measure the wings, they are identical.

  4. #14
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Quote Originally Posted by speeddemon
    Markster...the skinny on the Beguine, from Ed Horkey, the chief engineer on the project, was that the 6" difference was a complete RUMOR. In all the research I've done on the plane (and I did a ton of it back in the early '80's), the rumors varied from 6-18 inches of how much was cut off. Seems the legend grows as the story gets passed on. But the reality of it was that one wing pod was heavier than the other, which gave the flight characteristic of wanting to roll easier to the left than the right, but there was NOT a shorter wing on one side...despite the accepted belief that there was. If you take any symmetrical shot (head on, top/bottom view) and even go so far as to measure the wings, they are identical.
    The wing modification was done after Ed's involvement with the racer... so he knew nothing about it. The only people that knew about the modification were JD Reed, Walter Beech, and the handful of people that went to Anthony, KS who were involved in the actual modification of the right wing... Ed Horkey wasn't one of them. Don't believe me.... just watch the video.

    JD Reed speaks on the Beguine

    This was recorded in 1988 - and what a lot of my article was based on. If anyone would like to dispute the contents or originality of the video - then I'm more then happy to listen to them.

    Post up

    Edit: I should have said the right wing in my previous post - sorry for the error.
    Last edited by Pylon1_Mark; 12-10-2004 at 12:08 AM.
    Mark K....

  5. #15
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Mark-
    What was the source of the video clip, anything that's still available?
    ---------------
    Paul

  6. #16
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    The source of the video clip was Don Sherwin, a personal friend of JD Reed - and the interview was conducted on August 5, 1988 at the Beechcraft Office in Houston... focusing mainly on early Beechcraft history, JD Reed's & Walter Beech's involvement in the company and the aircraft industry in general, as well as why/how both got involved in aviation. The entire video is over 2 hours in length (you probably noticed JD wiping his mouth in the clip above... they had to break for lunch in the middle of the interview).
    Mark K....

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Man, I am glad that you have the energy to dig out these facts Mark! I wish I was better at racing history... for some reason, the major portion of it escapes me... I'd brand myself as unable to grasp history but I'm pretty well read and versed on WWII history as well as the Viet Nam war history but.. maybe it's because the history of air racing is not really as readily available in reading material as is that of the two wars I've studied since being a kid (WWII at least, I wasn't exactly a kid when Viet Nam went down)

    As you know, I'm really into the "what's happenin' now" stuff!! Love digging out the "poop" but I am very much in appreciation of those of us who pay attention to the history of the sport and who are not shy about sharing the information.

    I can hardly wait till my energy level returns a bit closer to normal and we can get going with the new site layout with more more more of this stuff!

    Wayne

  8. #18
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    I do find this type of stuff a lot of fun, it takes a lot of time (and sometimes, a lot of luck) to happen upon the right stuff.

    BTW Apteryx: No, the video was never intended for public distribution. It's not available anywhere as far as I know.
    Mark K....

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Thanks, Mark
    I'm like Wayne, a lot of blanks, on the early racing stuff, trying to fill some of those in, now.
    I think part of the problem, (as we've seen in this thread), is there's a lot of B.S. & half truths, floating around. So you tend to ignore the un-verifiable, stuff.
    Good to see somebody is, keeping track.....
    ---------------------------------
    Paul

  10. #20
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    Default Re: Race 21 (N5151) Mustang Info

    Quote Originally Posted by Apteryx
    I think part of the problem, (as we've seen in this thread), is there's a lot of B.S. & half truths, floating around. So you tend to ignore the un-verifiable, stuff.
    Paul, what I think I see here is a case of the guys who stand behind it not being cut were right... to the point that it was cut.. I had trouble understanding exactly what he said but from what I think I heard, they had wented it done, it was not done, so then it was done..

    Those who insist it was not, might not be aware that it was done later at Beech..

    W

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