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Thread: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

  1. #51

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by Fence Sence View Post
    The Sport class, while it doesn’t have the legendary status of the Unlimiteds, is everything the Unlimiteds used to be when there was a gold field full of hot rods. The upper crust of Sport is everything a gold class should or can be. I absolutely love it. This thread makes it even more awesome. Thanks to all you contributors. You guys rock.
    Apologies offered in advanced, but...

    I'm one of those who has lost interest in unlimiteds, unless and until incentives exist for a truly competitive Gold class. I can see warbirds fly in circles almost anywhere, and the current class is no more than a parade led by Dreadnaught.

    A truly unlimited field will need to be just that... remove the weight restriction, keep the piston/propeller mandate. An unlimited competitor - with modern technology -need not weigh 4500 lbs.

    Sport class, however, has peaked my interest in Reno... a "can't miss" item on my calendar (not in person, unfortunately). There's so much growth potential, even with the CI restriction.
    Last edited by TarDevil; 07-17-2019 at 10:05 AM.

  2. #52

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by supercub View Post
    How bout the "Unlimited Sport Class"
    Well, with the merging of sport and super sport (which allowed one-offs like the GP5) that's what we already have, and that is why sport has grown the way it has.

    You have a minimum speed and an engine size limit. As competitive as the class is, we are 20mph above the minimum speed limit just to make it to the ramp (not a typo, the FAA/RARA only allow 30-some airplanes in the sport pit so sport has to turn people away before they even have a chance to show up and qualify).

    As for the engine size, no one makes a 1000+ cu-in engine. So given the engines that are available it is unlimited. Now on one hand this makes the rule kind of redundant, but on the other it is good to have because it prevents a single wealthy person from putting a Merlin on their Legacy and beating everyone with only cash and HP.

    Quote Originally Posted by TarDevil View Post
    A truly unlimited field will need to be just that... remove the weight restriction, keep the piston/propeller mandate. An unlimited competitor - with modern technology -need not weigh 4500 lbs.
    That weight restriction is to keep sport planes out of the unlimiteds. And while I like to joke this is to save the unlimiteds the embarrassment of losing to a 6 cylinder, there are legit safety concerns with wake turbulence (ie even when you're in first you still have to lap people ).

    If you ignore the safety aspect and were to merge sport and unlimited into a single class you wouldn't gain any new fast* aircraft. That is to say there aren't any** airplanes out there under the weight limit of the unlimiteds but above the CI limit in sport. This sort of gets back to my point about the engine CI limit being somewhat redundant and more of a cost control.


    *I think you would gain the T-28s which qualify for the weight of the unlimiteds but are don't meet the minimum speed requirements. But if you want the T-28s in the show, and with the unlimited class being so small, it would be easiest to create an UNL/warbird medallion race on the T-6 course. This would get the T-28s in and bolster the unlimited field without the hassle of merging the two classes (not to mention their respective leadership committees).

    **There is the "Gumbo" racer project that shows up on Barnstormers every now and then. It's too light to be in unlimited and it has twin 720s or 780s.
    Last edited by CubersWrist; 07-17-2019 at 01:46 PM.
    "young" Thomas

  3. #53
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    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by TarDevil View Post
    Apologies offered in advanced, but...
    I'm one of those who has lost interest in unlimiteds, unless and until incentives exist for a truly competitive Gold class. I can see warbirds fly in circles almost anywhere, and the current class is no more than a parade led by Dreadnaught.
    This is understandable. The only difference to me is no matter what, Reno is still a race. It's not an airshow, the finishing order isn't planned ahead like a pre-airshow briefing. This makes the Unlimited class still more fun to watch than an average airshow. Dreadnought did a few passes around 400 at Chino this year that made me more than ready for September. Even stock P-51's go faster at Reno than they do at airshows because it's a competition! Even something as minor as Sparky with the covered gun ports screams Reno you gotta look for the little things with the Unlimited class in it's current state...

    Miss America was a big part of the Unlimited class for me last year, as Reno was the only place you could listen to a P-51 with a 'race' Merlin. Just the sound of Miss America was enough for me to enjoy the Unlimited class because it's out of the ordinary. Seeing Dreadnought trailing water around the last turn before home pylon, you don't get to see that at an airshow! Would love to see Goldfinger and Crusader a bit more raced out than last year, but not holding my breath.

    Overall, I'll always love Unlimited, Sport, and Jet each for their own reasons. F1 is a little slow for me, but I still enjoy the competition and innovation. Biplane and T-6 I could do without, not taking anything away from the pilots as it's all impressive flying at every level, just not as exciting as a spectator.
    *My Air Race Site*

    Reno from '99 to '19

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
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    Pacific Northwest
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    7,905

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Parade? While, I'll admit you have a "less competitive" field or should I say, less exciting without the likes of the Bear, Dago, Strega, Voodoo and others... But....to call what these guys and gals do a parade is pretty likely an insult to them!

    Even in some of the demo races I've seen and been a part of in the past, I guarantee you, the competitive nature of these race pilots is there, be it driving to the store, being first in line for chow or whatever...

    THERE ARE NO PARADES AT RENO!!!!!!!
    Wayne Sagar
    "Pusher of Electrons"

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    San Marcos, CA
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    665

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by GRNDP51 View Post
    This is understandable. The only difference to me is no matter what, Reno is still a race. It's not an airshow, the finishing order isn't planned ahead like a pre-airshow briefing. This makes the Unlimited class still more fun to watch than an average airshow. Dreadnought did a few passes around 400 at Chino this year that made me more than ready for September. Even stock P-51's go faster at Reno than they do at airshows because it's a competition! Even something as minor as Sparky with the covered gun ports screams Reno you gotta look for the little things with the Unlimited class in it's current state...

    Miss America was a big part of the Unlimited class for me last year, as Reno was the only place you could listen to a P-51 with a 'race' Merlin. Just the sound of Miss America was enough for me to enjoy the Unlimited class because it's out of the ordinary. Seeing Dreadnought trailing water around the last turn before home pylon, you don't get to see that at an airshow! Would love to see Goldfinger and Crusader a bit more raced out than last year, but not holding my breath.

    Overall, I'll always love Unlimited, Sport, and Jet each for their own reasons. F1 is a little slow for me, but I still enjoy the competition and innovation. Biplane and T-6 I could do without, not taking anything away from the pilots as it's all impressive flying at every level, just not as exciting as a spectator.
    This is exactly what make Reno, Reno. So many different levels of interest from racers and fans alike. Something for everybody. I'm a fan of all classes and like many have a certain affinity for the heavy metal (standing with the flaggers at Home Pylon while Strega and VooDoo ripped a single hole in the sky a few years ago was the rush of a lifetime) but also have the upmost respect and interest in watching a gaggle of Bips or F-1's rounding the sticks, or the T-6's start and rounding I/M1, or the Sports doing what shouldn't be done with an engine, and all the rest. There's only one place on the planet you can watch that...and we should do everything we can to ensure that continues to be the case for years to come...regardless of the class.

    And while I may understand the "parade" comment, Reno is no parade. May seem like that from the bleachers from time to time....but it's no parade. And I'd venture to guess you'd not regard it as such, were you strapped into the hurdling piece of machinery.
    Last edited by Air Boss; 07-17-2019 at 09:16 PM.
    Owen Ashurst
    Performer Air Boss - Reno Air Races
    Owner - AIR BOSS ONE
    San Diego CA
    http://airbossone.com

  6. #56
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    Sep 2015
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    Snohomish, WA
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    36

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by CubersWrist View Post
    *I think you would gain the T-28s which qualify for the weight of the unlimiteds but are don't meet the minimum speed requirements. But if you want the T-28s in the show, and with the unlimited class being so small, it would be easiest to create an UNL/warbird medallion race on the T-6 course. This would get the T-28s in and bolster the unlimited field without the hassle of merging the two classes (not to mention their respective leadership committees).
    Back around the time I started going to Reno, they tried a T-28 class. I really enjoyed that and wish that it had caught on.

    More on topic, I am loving the sport class in the last few years. One question, though. If they only allow 30 planes in the pits, how is it determined who gets a spot, since some people may not even get to try and qualify?

  7. #57

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    My thought on the parade issue is it depends on how hard the planes are being pushed. Last year Sport gold had some parade qualities, but I held my breath for the whole race and then again until Jeff was safely on the ground.

    Quote Originally Posted by wadeh View Post
    More on topic, I am loving the sport class in the last few years. One question, though. If they only allow 30 planes in the pits, how is it determined who gets a spot, since some people may not even get to try and qualify?
    Deciding which planes get to come to Reno is based purely on speed. For the folks that have raced before it is relatively simple because all the speeds and laptimes are on RARA's website. If there is a new team or an existing team makes a bunch of mods (ie Paul Downing's 360 and Olivier's Epsilon have whole new firewall forwards this year) then they can do some flight testing and present their data for consideration by the class leadership.
    "young" Thomas

  8. #58

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Actually, the correct number for Sport airplanes is 36 not 30.

    More on topic, I am loving the sport class in the last few years. One question, though. If they only allow 30 planes in the pits, how is it determined who gets a spot, since some people may not even get to try and qualify?[/QUOTE]

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    1,882

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by CubersWrist View Post
    My thought on the parade issue is it depends on how hard the planes are being pushed. Last year Sport gold had some parade qualities, but I held my breath for the whole race and then again until Jeff was safely on the ground.
    Sport Gold (sport in any capacity) is VERY far from a parade. Every sport pilot is there pushing the limit, and the maydays show that. I think the parade comment has to do with Mustangs flying around in a circle at conservative speeds, not “racing”, which I don’t agree with because anyone that shows up at Reno is competitive in some nature.

    But Sport Gold having parade qualities.....?? Not sure about that....
    *My Air Race Site*

    Reno from '99 to '19

  10. #60

    Default Re: 2019 Sport Gold Synopsis

    Quote Originally Posted by GRNDP51 View Post
    Sport Gold (sport in any capacity) is VERY far from a parade. Every sport pilot is there pushing the limit, and the maydays show that. I think the parade comment has to do with Mustangs flying around in a circle at conservative speeds, not “racing”, which I don’t agree with because anyone that shows up at Reno is competitive in some nature.

    But Sport Gold having parade qualities.....?? Not sure about that....
    Not to get too "in the weeds", but the confusing part is everyone seems to have a slightly different definition of parade. You and I seem to have about the same definition somewhere along the lines of:"No passing or threat of passing"

    But then you can also add in qualifiers like how hard are they pushing etc etc and it all drifts into the realm of legalese. *blegh!*

    anyways back to talking about airplanes and racing
    "young" Thomas

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