Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

[grampi]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

George Baker was the first to put a -3350 on a Sea Fury in 1986 (that airplane is now Sawbones). Blind Man's Bluff came next in '87, Cottonmouth in '88, Howards' Fury in '89....and then practically every Sea Fury in the world.

What convinced Frank S. to put the -4360 on the front of Dreadnought was when he flew 'chase' for the Super Corsair in 924 shortly before Reno '82....and Jim Maloney ran off and hid from the Centaurus-powered Sea Fury. Frank figured that the stock Sea Fury is faster than a stock F4U, so..........the rest is history.

I thought the Sea Fury was built at the factory with a 3350?

[grampi]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

Was the huge corn-cob really worth the effort?

The B-36 needed it for sure [ "6 turnin' & 4 burnin' "]

But did the military Jug [XP-72] or Corsair truly benefit from that fat log? Not really..

So maybe the race-jobs did.. or was it just a matter of max cubic inches for the buck - when all said & done?

& yet.. I guess we'll see..

Didn't the F2G have considerable performance improvements over the R-2800 versions?

[Tigercat24]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

I thought the Sea Fury was built at the factory with a 3350?

The Hawker Sea Fury was a British design...and as such had a British engine: the Bristol Centaurus 18 sleeve-valve radial with 2,480 HP.

People began replacing these engines with the American-made Wright R-3350's, primarily the -26 version from the Douglas Skyraider, for a couple of reasons:

1. Limited parts and replacements for the original Centaurus.

2. Abundance of parts for the R-3350.

3. Limited tuning potential for racers due to design.

There have been 2 Sea Furies with R-4360 conversion: Dreadnought and Furias.

The list of Sea Furies with R-3350 conversion is extensive.

One Sea Fury has a Pratt & Whitney R-2800: Argonaut...Argo was a parts-built Sea Fury built by the Sanders family with a R-3350....R-3350 blew up, so it was converted to R-2800.

[flyingjibus]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

The Hawker Sea Fury was a British design...and as such had a British engine: the Bristol Centaurus 18 sleeve-valve radial with 2,480 HP.

People began replacing these engines with the American-made Wright R-3350's, primarily the -26 version from the Douglas Skyraider, for a couple of reasons:

1. Limited parts and replacements for the original Centaurus.

2. Abundance of parts for the R-3350.

3. Limited tuning potential for racers due to design.

There have been 2 Sea Furies with R-4360 conversion: Dreadnought and Furias.

The list of Sea Furies with R-3350 conversion is extensive.

One Sea Fury has a Pratt & Whitney R-2800: Argonaut...Argo was a parts-built Sea Fury built by the Sanders family with a R-3350....R-3350 blew up, so it was converted to R-2800.

And we have come full circle and are now seeing 3350 Sea Furys going back to the centaurus due to issues with 3350's starting to pop up.

[FlyKidChris]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

Didn't the F2G have considerable performance improvements over the R-2800 versions?

The biggest benefit was in climb. Climb is a function of excess thrust.

[thunderstangfan]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

doubt your going to see too many centaurus conversions because the parts are so rare...

[Leo]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

One of the reasons the 4360 powered F2G did not go into large-scale production is that it's performance was not a leap over the Bearcat, which WAS going into production. Basically a production aircraft existed that did the job so why?
I know the 4360 has few potential hot rodding possibilities BUT at least in Dread's case it gives them good power and a very reliable racer. It's the reason they have few championships but almost always seem to finish in the top group, at around 450+/-.

[440_Magnum]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

I thought the Sea Fury was built at the factory with a 3350?

OK, now I KNOW you're yanking our chains... :-p

Go look at "924," which has a stock Sea Fury powerplant. Count propellor blades, and note DIRECTION of propellor rotation...

It still amazes me that the Sea Fury flies perfectly fine after reversing the prop torque and up/downwash sides after the conversion to American powerplants.

The Sanders' also recounted the fact that all the bolt holes for putting an oil cooler on the other side from stock were there and waiting, which is why Dreadnought has dual coolers that look so much like they SHOULD both be there.

[Tigercat24]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

The biggest benefit was in climb. Climb is a function of excess thrust.

There was a small measurable performance increase in climb...but the straight line speed wasn't much different from the R-2800-powered F4U-4.

[440_Magnum]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

The Hawker Sea Fury was a British design...and as such had a British engine: the Bristol Centaurus 18 sleeve-valve radial with 2,480 HP.

People began replacing these engines with the American-made Wright R-3350's, primarily the -26 version from the Douglas Skyraider, for a couple of reasons:

1. Limited parts and replacements for the original Centaurus.

2. Abundance of parts for the R-3350.

3. Limited tuning potential for racers due to design.

I would add that the stock Centaurus puts out generally similar power to a stock 3350 and is probably a little more reliable if run entirely within the stock military envelope. But it didn't respond as well to racing- probably the fact that putting a lot of extra heat through the sleeve valve and into the cylinder walls causes problems. As Napier found out, getting sleeve valves to work is a balancing act to start with. Bristol did it very well, but get outside of the parameters where they did all their testing....

One Sea Fury has a Pratt & Whitney R-2800: Argonaut...Argo was a parts-built Sea Fury built by the Sanders family with a R-3350....R-3350 blew up, so it was converted to R-2800.

Argo blew up a lot of 3350s... one of them absolutely spectacularly. To the point that the Sanders were frustrated enough to never want to deal with a 3350 again. Some 3350s have run reliably for years (Pardue's, Spirit of Texas for example) before failing. But quite a few others have experienced rapid unintentional disassembly at speed. The overall success of the 3350 is mixed, at best.

[440_Magnum]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

One of the reasons the 4360 powered F2G did not go into large-scale production is that it's performance was not a leap over the Bearcat, which WAS going into production. Basically a production aircraft existed that did the job so why?
I know the 4360 has few potential hot rodding possibilities BUT at least in Dread's case it gives them good power and a very reliable racer. It's the reason they have few championships but almost always seem to finish in the top group, at around 450+/-.

You also have to remember that Dreadnought is a trainer with a fully functioning second set of controls, long stock trainer canopy, etc. There has been great care applied to the airframe, it has a tall tail for stability, but no turtledeck, small canopy... things like that. I had really high hopes that Furias, marrying the same powerplant as Dreadnought with aero more like 232, could go out and set a new Sea Fury speed record last year. And maybe it could have, but alas, it wasn't to be

I'll freely admit to being a P&W admirer. My gut thinks that both the 2800 and 4360 have more reliability/power quotient, and the 4360 probably has more relibility*power product than the 3350. But the wrench-turners may well prove me wrong on that ;-)

[flyingjibus]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

You also have to remember that Dreadnought is a trainer with a fully functioning second set of controls, long stock trainer canopy, etc. There has been great care applied to the airframe, it has a tall tail for stability, but no turtledeck, small canopy... things like that. I had really high hopes that Furias, marrying the same powerplant as Dreadnought with aero more like 232, could go out and set a new Sea Fury speed record last year. And maybe it could have, but alas, it wasn't to be

I'll freely admit to being a P&W admirer. My gut thinks that both the 2800 and 4360 have more reliability/power quotient, and the 4360 probably has more relibility*power product than the 3350. But the wrench-turners may well prove me wrong on that ;-)

I am a P&W believer as well. I wish someone would (successfully) get into the hot rodded 4360 racing game.

[bill_f]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

Within the 'cat family, apparently there were 4360 Hellcat variants designated "G59" and "G60" that probably never made it ONTO the drawing board, let alone off. And "G61" was to be a turbojet -- the times they were a-changin'.

http://www.airvectors.net/avf6f.html

[Samuel]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

One Sea Fury has a Pratt & Whitney R-2800: Argonaut...Argo was a parts-built Sea Fury built by the Sanders family with a R-3350....R-3350 blew up, so it was converted to R-2800.

Didn't Argonaut smoke the first R-2800 they hung on it?

[J.A.W.]

Re: Has an R-4360 ever been hung on the nose of a Bearcat?

Of course, what a Fury really needs.. - is a Sabre VII hauling it..

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/Fury/Sea_Fury_Flight.pdf

How would a Bearcat go with a Sabre?, Well for sure, she'd look purtier with that nose-job..