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Thread: No demo team for Reno 2013

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    NV
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    1,498

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    I'm sorry for getting political on Military Demo Teams. I just don't understand we they always want to cut Defense/Military from the budget.
    Lockheed Bob

  2. #12

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by N22252 View Post
    I know thundering fighter jet teams sell tickets, but I would pay more to see the Horsemen anyday
    I think big Steve is more than a little busy with the Unlimited Pace/Safety flying he has to do.

  3. #13

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Race5 View Post
    Anyone know what the current cost is for the major jet teams? The last numbers I saw were something like $10k per day plus fuel, lodging, transportation, and security.
    So I would say pretty close to 25k-30k a day. The Blue Angel's required the city to close down hwy 395 and a full police escort to and from the venue. Damn I wonder what that cost RARA?! Yikes!!!

  4. #14

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Lockheed Bob View Post
    What does it cost the taxpayer for 2 weeks in Hawaii for a 747 plus lodging ,food,security,etc.? Would you rather watch Air Force One do a few flybys or a military Demo Team? Enough for now.
    I too feel that Air Force One is logging a lot of hours and cycles that aren't "official government business".. but to bring this thing back on topic...

    Could a 747 ever turn a 500 MPH lap on the unlimited course?

  5. #15

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    I would rather see mock dogfights between some P-40's and a Zero, P-51 vs. a FW190 and stuff like they do at Oshkosh. Ton's of pyro's, mock drops, huge walls of fire for the 50th. People also pay to see that! Put more money in private owners pocket books. In short more warbird and GA acts!

    Last edited by Wild Bill Kelso; 12-12-2012 at 02:05 PM.

  6. #16
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    Aug 2004
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    Santa Fe, NM
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    120

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    In1998 Santa Fe Air Show had the T-birds:
    $12,000 due in April
    smoke oil
    rooms for 100+
    Vehicles for over 80+
    +food
    Our attendance was the same is the previous 3 yrs
    Working with them was the worst air show experience I have ever had


    I understand RENO is VERY different and they don't stay at Stead

    Ken

    I,ll bring the care and feeding manual to RENO this yr if anyone is interested

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Seattle, Washington
    Posts
    1,877

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by kensantafe View Post
    In1998 Santa Fe Air Show had the T-birds:
    $12,000 due in April
    smoke oil
    rooms for 100+
    Vehicles for over 80+
    +food
    Our attendance was the same is the previous 3 yrs
    Working with them was the worst air show experience I have ever had


    I understand RENO is VERY different and they don't stay at Stead

    Ken

    I,ll bring the care and feeding manual to RENO this yr if anyone is interested
    I have dealt with hosting both the Blue Angels and the Thunderbirds at airshows firsthand. EVERYTHING about them is expensive and high maintenance, especially if you read through the hosting manuals....some of the stuff seems outrageous.

    HOWEVER, in their defense, the hosting manual is high-maintenance for a very good reason. It provides a guideline so that ANY airshow, from Oshkosh to the Podunk County Pancake Feed & Fly-In to a remote base in a foreign country anywhere in the world can host an airshow to the same standards. It may seem stupid, but what it does is ensure a safe environment that is identical with known quantities at each site. Everything is done for a reason...even down to providing police escort in 'new' cars at each show site, and separating the brown M&M's out of the bowl.

    The layman airshow spectator has no idea how much of a logistical ballet is for supporting any of the elite teams. It's not like the guy in the Tailorcraft that flies into town and his wife shows up in the 'dualie' support truck two days later and the logistics are limited to re-stringing the ribbon for the inverted pick up or filling up the corvis oil tank.

  8. #18
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    Aug 2004
    Location
    Santa Fe, NM
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    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    I worked the show for 8 years
    Last 3 as chairman/airshow director,
    Not exactly a layman
    I'm sure very few have your experience, but some have a little bit-- taking them out of layman status

    Stop by Santa Fe I;ll buy the green chili

    Ken

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Seattle, Washington
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    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by kensantafe View Post
    I worked the show for 8 years
    Last 3 as chairman/airshow director,
    Not exactly a layman
    I'm sure very few have your experience, but some have a little bit-- taking them out of layman status

    Stop by Santa Fe I;ll buy the green chili

    Ken
    I wasn't implying that YOU were he layman, Ken...not at all. But 95% or more of the spectators at a show are, and they just know that they pay the bills and watch the show....without really having an appreciation for what goes on behind the scenes.

  10. #20

    Default Re: No demo team for Reno 2013

    I read many of the posts but very seldom get involved. But I have decided to weigh in on this discussion. I have been a devoted follower of this site for years, but rarely have I made posts over that time. However, this topic has piqued my interest. I have attended the past 27 National Championship Air Races plus several PRS extended weekends. My air racing exposure goes back even farther to Homestead in 1979 and even to the early TV broadcasts of air racing back in the 1960s. In addition I had the great privilege of working on Precious Metal for three years in the early 2000s. My love of war birds is immense, and I know it is for many of you that post on this site.

    I am in agreement with those of you that only want to see war birds. That is precisely why I go to Reno. That is precisely why people from all over the country—all over the world for that matter—attend the event. It is the only event of its kind. The draw is the war birds. The draw is the sight, the sound, and the feel of those mighty planes that we all love. The draw is watching the progression of Sunday’s Gold Unlimited field make its way to the ramp in front of the grandstands. The draw is the introduction of the pilots and their mighty mounts. The draw is watching them all fire up, taxi out, and take to the air for that annual duel that we all so eagerly anticipate throughout the year. The draw is watching them accelerate down the chute and round the pylons. That is what gives us goose bumps. That is why we attend Reno.

    Personally, I can do without the Thunderbirds or the Blue Angels—and as a Marine it pains me to say that—and their 19 minutes of show center time from an 80-minute, or longer, program. Yes, I have timed them. I can most certainly do without the constant air race filler (aka air show performers) and extremely annoying—for the most part—music and inane chatter that too often drowns out the beautiful sound of war birds taking off for their next race. That is something that can easily be had at other venues.

    As some contributors have noted, the logistics for the T-Birds or Blues is significant. The cost is significant. The cost is also significant for the many air show acts. For years I have been telling my friends that I would gladly pay more for my tickets if RARA would just dispense with the filler and focus on the air races. Would this not help the sport?

    One more comment and I hope I am not being too hypocritical. I believe there used to be a lot more military demos and fly-bys, especially the fly-bys. It seems to me these have tapered off over the years. Has this become apparent to anyone else? While I have emphatically stated that the draw is the Unlimiteds, I do like the military demos and fly-bys, and I believe these come at no cost; certainly the fly-bys. That said, the format I would like to see would be an increased focus on the air racers with an increase in military demos and fly-bys. And I would like RARA to wrap up the races sooner in the day before the bothersome winds pick up and cause problems for us all.

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