ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

[First time Juke]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_TS-11_Iskra

Here is my 3 days old shot of the TS-11 !!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSHqhS4iwis

[Race5]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_TS-11_Iskra

Here is my 3 days old shot of the TS-11 !!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSHqhS4iwis

Nope.

[First time Juke]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Nope.

Why not ?

It would be milder in sweep than the Learstang wing but yet more arrow shaped than the existing wing ?!

Iskra has 4 records and is the longest served jet trainer ever.

[GeoffS]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

...yet more arrow shaped than the existing wing...

What do you mean by "arrow shaped"? Tapered?

[Race5]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Why not ?

It would be milder in sweep than the Learstang wing but yet more arrow shaped than the existing wing ?!

Iskra has 4 records and is the longest served jet trainer ever.

A lot of reason aerodynamically, and on top of that you'd never get long enough gear legs in it. You'd be better off starting from scratch.

[AirDOGGe]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Many people look at swept wings and think" Ohhh, fast. They LOOK faster, and they put them on jets after all so they MUST be faster wings, right?"

Nope.

Swept wings of the same span, chord and airfoil shape don't really make for a faster aircraft, at least not at all speeds. They just handle trans-sonic/super-sonic speeds and their resulting interfering shock-waves better than straight wings, reducing drag and improving control in that region. THIS is what makes them better in the proper application.


You really don't need swept wings at Stead. The track is too tight to approach trans-sonic speed (sometimes suggested as around 600mph - 900mph, but varies by altitude and temp, and sometimes opinion ).


Remember, aircraft wings didn't need sweep until jets appeared that could reach those velocities in level flight.



.

[Bob]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Didnt they have to put fences on the wings of early swept wing jets? Something about the sweep not being good at slower speeds?

[First time Juke]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Didnt they have to put fences on the wings of early swept wing jets? Something about the sweep not being good at slower speeds?

Yeah they did, but that was at 35-45 deg sweep.

I mean arrow shape as in an arrow head.

Enst Heinkel's last prop design ( by Siegfriend Gunter who also designed Mig-15 and -19 ) had forward sweep a lot and 800+ km/h estimated top speed.

[First time Juke]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

What do you mean by "arrow shaped"? Tapered?

Tapered...but swept yes.

[AirDOGGe]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

Didnt they have to put fences on the wings of early swept wing jets? Something about the sweep not being good at slower speeds?

Early MIGs used them, as did some other early jets. The airflow over a swept wing tends to curve towards the wingtips at lower speeds, reducing lift. The fences were an attempt to solve this issue.

Pardon my sloppy quick&dirty drawing here:

[jotunn]

Re: ISKRA TS-11 wing geometry good for P-51D ?

They just handle trans-sonic/super-sonic speeds and their resulting interfering shock-waves better than straight wings, reducing drag and improving control in that region.
.

I'd also add that swept wings can affect both lateral and directional stability. Sweep also shifts the Cp aft which helps maintain it aft of the Cg in some aircraft.

...but, that's neither here nor there, since Race5 said it best, "You'd be better off starting from scratch."