Well?

[Fence Sence]

Hi everyone. It's been a while since I've posted anything so I figured I would restart a discussion that, the last time it was brought up, seemed to get a lot of people fired up.

The new Super Sport rumor and the Wildfire project got my wheels turning so maybe I can get yours turning. Where is this sport with regards to pilot safety? What is being done? What can be done? I can't help but think of the advancements of Dragboat racing and the safety canopy they employ. Can this not be done for air racing? Why not? If not, what else can be done? It's been a rough couple of years at the races as we all know. I, for one, was sure the Bear was gonna be gone until the unflappable Mr. Penny pulled one out of his...

Now, I'm a firm believer in "One man's rights end where another mans nose begins" and it is his (or her) right to strap in to whatever contraption they so desire. However, in a sanctioned event, the governing body has to bear some responsibility (IMHO) for the safety of it's participants. We all know the risks involved with this venture, but can't it be done safely? Anyone?

[SCEPTER]

Re: Well?

Whats new dude? As for safety structures in airplanes, it comes down to two things, $$$$$ and weight. Hopefully safety will prevail at Reno in the years to come.

[AirDOGGe]

Re: Well?

...I can't help but think of the advancements of Dragboat racing and the safety canopy they employ. Can this not be done for air racing? Why not?

The safety canopy for drag boats is to help prevent drowning more than anything, isn't it? I don't see how ANY form of canopy or cage can protect a pilot dropping out of the sky. There's too much energy envolved.

You can't put instantly-inflating air bags on the aircraft to cushion unwanted ground contact (Mars Rover-style, I mean)...The vehicles are too heavy and there's no room for a sufficent size and quantity of airbags. Nor can you cover the desert with the same to safely land upon.

What about aircraft safety chutes, ala Cirrus SR-20? In every case I can think of where a race pilot was lost, there wasn't enough altitude for a parachute to help.

With weight and limited on-board space being a big issue, I can't see how one can make the sport safer beyond the inspections of airframes and pilots for race-worthiness that are currently being used.

Air Racing is far more dangerous and difficult to make safer than drag boats because it's a 3-dimensional sport, where you have to deal with vertical motion as well as direction and forward velocity, and it's usually the former that causes all the losses.

"What else can be done?" That says it all in a nutshell. I think they've done all that can be reasonably and practically expected.


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[Skyracer]

Re: Well?

Designing a survival capsule to skip across the water at 250+ is very different than applying that same technology to bounce across dirt and rocks at 500. Not poo-pooing the idea nor ignoring the need to continually improve safety, but as stated earlier, $$$ and weight does not currently equate to a significant enough improvement to justify it.

[Leo]

Re: Well?

Hi Sence!
In most of the fatal crashes I have seen since 1976, there was little or no time to do anything about escape. Whether mid-air, or breakup, or ground contact there simply was nothing to be done short of avoiding the situation in the first place. If there is time to assess and react, it is usually now an emergency, not a crash. I agree that the forces are too high for any reasonable passive system to help G. Carlin's line about making the whole aircraft out of the black box materials fits here) and They have plenty of good equipment and options now. I think if there is time to uses a seat there is probably time to climb and use the chute. How many of the pilots would have been saved by a zero-zero system? Is it worth the weight. I guess so to the one it saves!

[taglialavore]

Re: Well?

When I was younger, all the related to spatial race was passing through the NASA and the URSS. Nowadays I can see other enterprises offering trips to outer space using their own designed vehicles. I know well, depends on money and technological developments,...and a lot of brain.
May be in the future we see Unlimiteds with ejection seats.

[Blue Foam]

Re: Well?

Having written an extensive treatise on pilot safety the utility of ejections seats in air racing, I have pretty strong opinions about pilot safety in general and ejection seats specifically. I am grateful to this site for publishing the series of articles, it would take too much space to repeat them here. In summary:

1. Crash forces are obscenely high and the space and weight restrictions of aircraft prevent significant crash structure;
2. Ejection seats encompass a wide range of capabilities, many of which take too much time to activate, or are too heavy and bulky to be useful to air racers;
3. One narrow range of pilot "extraction system" fits the greatest percentage (NOT all) of air racing fatalities. These systems, past and present weigh 25 to 40 lb and are practical for about half of the current fleet of competitors without modification and most of the rest with mods. Everyone: F1, Biplanes, T-6, Sport, Unlimiteds. Some war-era T-28's were even equipped with Ranger systems in case they ever come back.

Sadly, the only American manufacturer of these systems stopped making them decades ago. The Russian supplier of equivalent hardware entered the international market without proper support and exited a few years ago. All of the applicable hardware, both eastern and western that has found its way near to the air racing world has out-of-date chutes and pyros. It may be possible to duplicate these products given time and money beyond what air racing alone can offer.

[Fence Sence]

Re: Well?

Allright! That's what I like to see.

Obviously a drag boat canopy would not work. It's more the concept I'm looking at. I'm pretty sure the phrase "Can't be done" should be thrown out the proverbial window. Evil Knievel once said no one will ever jump a motorcycle 300ft. Can't be done. What's the record now? 351, with talk of going 400.

In a time when so many are jobless, including myself, I'm thinking of what can be done. It all comes down to $$$ I know but, you can't have a dream come true unless you have a dream.