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Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

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  • Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

    I'm sure Dago Red could do it, and I'm almost as sure Strega could do it too. In fact, I think Dago did 536.XX mph for the 3K closed course, so I see no reason why he couldn't do it for the 5K as well.
    Last edited by grampi; 06-19-2008, 12:51 PM.

  • #2
    Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

    Originally posted by grampi
    I'm sure Dago Red could do it, and I'm almost as sure Strega could do it too. In fact, I think Dago did 536.XX mph for the 3K closed course, so I see no reason why he couldn't do it for the 5K as well.
    Dago Red has done the 15 km speed record twice. 517 mph in 1983, and 536 mph in 1997. But I don't think it counted in 1997 because of timing issues (didn't the cameras clock the pace plane instead of the Mustang?).

    Dago has only attempted the 3 km speed record once, in 1984, and that ended unsuccessfully in some very expensive engine changes and airframe damage.

    The major difference here is that the 15km record can be done at altitude and obviously has much greater distance to 'stretch the legs' of the aircraft attempting the run, as well as being done over a 'one way' course. The 3km record, as I recall, has and time restrictions measured over a two-way course at a restricted, very low altitude. And it is the average of four timed runs through the traps.

    Everything I have ever heard about the 3km record is that IT is the one that you really have to have your **** together to 'earn'. It is much harder on the pilot and aircraft than the 15 km run, which is a 'relative' cake walk. (And that is not to disrespect the effort and money that go into setting that record. I'm just saying that relatively, it's a big difference between the two)

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

      I don't think Dago has it in her anymore. No more Mouse for sure and no more crew (Slack et al.)

      Saw a pic from PRS......she's there...is she healthy? Who knows
      Last edited by Red; 06-19-2008, 06:08 PM. Reason: spellin'
      Red
      chanting...400+

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

        Originally posted by Red
        I don't think Dago has it in her anymore. No more Mouse for sure and no more crew (Slack et al.)

        Saw a pic from PRS......she's there...is she healthy? Who knows
        No more Mouse? What's a Mouse and what's this PRS I keep seeing mentioned?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

          A mouse refers the to motor that Dwight Thorn and his minions were famous for building. No one since has been able to duplicate the loving combination or horsepower/reliability. The water pumpers have had a bleak last few years. I hope that will change soon.

          PRS is Pylon Racing School. It is a qualification of sorts that all new race pilots and non current race pilots in all classes must attend prior to racing in September. Sort of a precheck out before the races. It is in session right now through Saturday.

          Hope that helps
          Red
          chanting...400+

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

            Originally posted by Red
            A mouse refers the to motor that Dwight Thorn and his minions were famous for building. No one since has been able to duplicate the loving combination or horsepower/reliability. The water pumpers have had a bleak last few years. I hope that will change soon.

            PRS is Pylon Racing School. It is a qualification of sorts that all new race pilots and non current race pilots in all classes must attend prior to racing in September. Sort of a precheck out before the races. It is in session right now through Saturday.

            Hope that helps
            So DT no longer builds motors for Dago? Why not?

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

              He doesn't build motors at all unfortunately. He had a stroke some years back. He held all the secrets and has not chosen to pass them on.
              Red
              chanting...400+

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                Originally posted by Red
                He doesn't build motors at all unfortunately. He had a stroke some years back. He held all the secrets and has not chosen to pass them on.
                No wonder Bear wins every year then.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                  Here are the unlimited gold winners for the years that Rare Bear was entered. Interesting and fun digging this up for you
                  2007 it was Rare Bear
                  2006 it was September Fury
                  2005 It was Dago red
                  2004 it was Rare Bear.
                  2003 it was Dago Red
                  2002 it was Dago Red
                  2001 races cancelled
                  2000 it was Dago Red
                  1999 it was Dago Red
                  1998 it was Dago Red
                  1997 it was Strega
                  1996 it was Strega
                  1995 it was Strega
                  1994 it was Miss America, unlimited gold.
                  1994 it was Rare Bear, Unlimited Super Gold Shootout
                  1993 it was Strega.
                  1992 it was Strega
                  1991 it was Rare Bear
                  1990 it was Rare Bear
                  1989 it was Rare Bear
                  1988 it was Rare Bear
                  1987 it was Strega
                  1986 it was Dreadnought
                  1985 it was Super Corsair
                  1984 it was Dreadnought
                  1983 it was Dago Red
                  1982 it was Dago Red
                  1981 it was Jeannie
                  1980 it was Jeannie

                  1980 is the first year that Rare Bear shows up in the RARA database.

                  Hope this helps, was alot of fun to dig this info up.

                  Bob

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                    Originally posted by grampi
                    I'm sure Dago Red could do it, and I'm almost as sure Strega could do it too. In fact, I think Dago did 536.XX mph for the 3K closed course, so I see no reason why he couldn't do it for the 5K as well.

                    short answer:

                    Because they cant.

                    Long answer: All reasons mentioned in above posts.


                    In the coming year or two I fully expect The Bear to go after those records and blow them out of the water.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                      Originally posted by flyingjibus
                      short answer:

                      Because they cant.

                      Long answer: All reasons mentioned in above posts.


                      In the coming year or two I fully expect The Bear to go after those records and blow them out of the water.
                      Why would you say they can't? Do you think Dago isn't fast enough to break the record, or are there other issues? Also, what makes you think Bear is any faster now than when it was when they set the record?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                        Originally posted by grampi
                        Why would you say they can't? Do you think Dago isn't fast enough to break the record, or are there other issues? Also, what makes you think Bear is any faster now than when it was when they set the record?
                        As Dago sites right now, it wouldn't stand a chance. I talked to the crew at the PRS on Wednesday, and the plane has a stock Merlin in it. Now, I'm sure that will change by September, but it's going to be a very tall order to to get another engine that will hum like a Mouse Motor.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                          Originally posted by Bob
                          Here are the unlimited gold winners for the years that Rare Bear was entered. Interesting and fun digging this up for you
                          2007 it was Rare Bear
                          2006 it was September Fury
                          2005 It was Dago red
                          2004 it was Rare Bear.
                          2003 it was Dago Red
                          2002 it was Dago Red
                          2001 races cancelled
                          2000 it was Dago Red
                          1999 it was Dago Red
                          1998 it was Dago Red
                          1997 it was Strega
                          1996 it was Strega
                          1995 it was Strega
                          1994 it was Miss America, unlimited gold.
                          1994 it was Rare Bear, Unlimited Super Gold Shootout
                          1993 it was Strega.
                          1992 it was Strega
                          1991 it was Rare Bear
                          1990 it was Rare Bear
                          1989 it was Rare Bear
                          1988 it was Rare Bear
                          1987 it was Strega
                          1986 it was Dreadnought
                          1985 it was Super Corsair
                          1984 it was Dreadnought
                          1983 it was Dago Red
                          1982 it was Dago Red
                          1981 it was Jeannie
                          1980 it was Jeannie

                          1980 is the first year that Rare Bear shows up in the RARA database.

                          Hope this helps, was alot of fun to dig this info up.

                          Bob
                          Lyle started racing the Bearcat in 1969 if memory serves me right. (Able Cat?)
                          Do a search in the database by pilot name.
                          The Bear won in 1973 & 1975.
                          Would have won 1974 except for penalties levied to a bunch of racers.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                            Originally posted by grampi
                            I'm sure Dago Red could do it, and I'm almost as sure Strega could do it too. In fact, I think Dago did 536.XX mph for the 3K closed course, so I see no reason why he couldn't do it for the 5K as well.
                            The 3km is just not that easy, grampi. The speed you gave Dago is for the 15km, which is not as hard to get.

                            The Bear has been down on power for years, so people forget. 507mph?? People forget there is a 'fudge factor' now too. They lengthened the course without moving the pylons, so you can't compare speeds before '03 directly. Not sayin' Dago hasn't been fast... just sayin'.

                            For now and the future, Rare Bear holds the propeller driven speed record at 528 and change. And that is only because The Bear ran outta nitrous... with nitrous they were clocked somewhere around 540mph!

                            Respect the Bear, or you will be bitten...

                            ~R.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Why doesn't anyone ever attempt to break Rare Bear's speed record?

                              Originally posted by Bigger Al
                              As Dago sites right now, it wouldn't stand a chance. I talked to the crew at the PRS on Wednesday, and the plane has a stock Merlin in it. Now, I'm sure that will change by September, but it's going to be a very tall order to to get another engine that will hum like a Mouse Motor.
                              Why doesn't someone tear down a Mouse motor and simply reverse engineer a new one?

                              Comment

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